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Friday, June 03, 2005

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rosedog

Interesting thread.

One small point however: Rockford, some of the conservative sites appear to be spinning a recent Business Week story that shows that the RNC is ahead of the DNC in fundraising, into a pronouncement that Dean is a failure as a fundraiser.

In reality, according to the Federal Elections Commission reports, Dean has raised more money in the first quarter of an off year than any DNC Chair in history. Here are the figures for the last four years, but you can go to the FEC site to see the rest.

http://images.nictusa.com/cgi-bin/fecimg/?C00010603

Dean's first Quarter of 2005 - $16.7 million
As opposed to:

Q1/2004 - $28.7 million (the election year bounce)
Q1/2003 - $8.7 million
Q1/2002 - $11.8


Michael Turner

Rockford: "Can you have large social spending and military expenditures? Sure. We had em both in WWII. What's needed is a concentrated effort to win the war and then go home to a safer and transformed world."

Yes, but in WWII, there was also a high inflation rate, rationing, a draft -- all of which would not have been tolerated by Americans unless the war had huge political legitimacy and some prospect of being won. The War on Terror is hardly even a war, much less the kind of state-actor total war that can be won by simple application of overwhelming force. (Anything like such application of overwhelming force is only likely to grow more Jihadis, a sowing of dragon's teeth.) Certain figures in this administration, from Bush on down, have at times admitted that it might go on virtually forever. ("Virtually forever" meaning "past election years that we aren't even seriously thinking about yet, like 2012.")

OK, shot that fish in that barrel, so back to the salt mines for the day.

Mark A. York

Don't dare compare this farce to WWII. That's a false comparison abd invalid. Talk to someone who was there. I have.

Nell

reg, thanks for the tip about the Iraq thread at TPMCafe (David Gelber 'Back to the Present'). That site has so many corners that the thread might be hard to find once it scrolls off the front page:

http://www.tpmcafe.com/story/2005/6/3/73837/52927

Mark is right about a WWII comparison in some respects. Here are the ones that come to mind:

1. FDR lied to the American people when he said we
would not take sides and our boys would not be
fighting in a foreign war, while at the time
siding with Britain and preparing America for
war in the background. Google Lead-Lease.

The difference is the press had no concerted
effort to tell the world 'the truth' about
FDR's lies, and the lies of the military about
how well the war was going at the start.

2. A combination of tight control on the press as
well as less of a selfishness for personal fame
(or infamy, you choose)kept 'the truth' about
the personal cost of war off the front pages
and radio broadcast, so as to not discourage
the American people and WIN!

3. Any misbehavior by our soldiers was handled
behind the scene, not played out before the
world in the press, in case it could demoralize
the American people and it's military. Handing
the enemy anti-american propaganda material.

4. FDR actually admitted were in a war and
encouraged the American people to 'Mark is right about a WWII comparison in some respects. Here are the ones that come to mind:

1. FDR lied to the American people when he said we
would not take sides and our boys would not be
fighting in a foreign war, while at the time
sideing with Britian and preparing America for
war in the background. Google Lead-Lease.

The difference is the press had no concerted
effort to tell the world 'the truth' about
FDR's lies, and the lies of the military about
how well the war was going at the start.

2. A combination of tight control on the press as
well as less of a selfishness for personal fame
(or infamy, you choose)kept 'the truth' about
the personal cost of war off the front pages
and radio broadcast, so as to not discourage
the American people and WIN!

3. Any misbehavior by our soldiers was handled
behind the senes, not played out before the
world in the press, in case it could demoralize
the American people and it's military, while
giving the enemy anti-american propaganda
material.

4. FDR actually admitted were were in a war and
encouraged the American people to 'sacrifice'
in order that we prevail. And they did, includ-
ing the press's desire to 'tell the truth'.

GWB has asked nothing from us or the press,
and he is getting it. Is it because he knows
he wouldn't?

I could go on, but it's your turn.

Sorry for the repeat. I wanted to be sure you read it all. :)

And Lead-Lease should be Lend-Lease.

Jim R

The above comment was mine. My new computer doesn't recognize me yet.

green dem

Rockford is right about Hillary, although his taste in murderous femme fatales makes me question my own judgment about her.

Jami

actually, it's hard to imagine winning when people like you split the left in half. pretty obviously stupid, frankly.

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